but what do we do okay we recognize sin in us or or shame in us and we recognize maybe somebody stuck in a cycle of shame that we love very much jim you’ve mentioned a couple of things don’t say um what were you thinking i think that’s a really good helpful practical tip but what do we do and i’d love to hear both from joel and jim on this what do we do when shame is very present yeah i would say let’s listen to what paul says and this might be helpful ephesians 4 and i think it’s important to understand what’s happening in the city of ephesus

the temple of artemis is there it’s one of the wonders of the world this is a place when we talk about all these things i mean debauchery and fornication and drug addiction i mean this was rampant in uh in the temple of artemis nothing new under the sun there is nothing new underneath the sun we’ve been turning to the same vices uh for for ages since the beginning and yet there is a virtue that god has given us that we should seek after and this is how paul describes it and what paul’s doing is really summarizing what we’ve

been talking about this idea that and we’re going to talk about it more later there is an old self that is associated with a dark way of living that is bent on self-glorification which is ultimately self-hatred i’m curious what you think about that but that’s really great kind of what i think right that’s where it ends yeah like we think we’re glorifying ourselves but actually we’re it’s an act of hatred of self-hatred and so it’s so it’s so intriguing but this is what paul says and he starts in verse 22. okay what

chapter are we in ephesians chapter four i would definitely suggest you read verses 17-22 he talks about the futility of our minds we were once darkened in our understanding we were alienated from the life of god so that is our past sense but then in verse 22 he says this to put off your old self which belongs to your former manner of life and is corrupt through what deceitful desires and to be renewed so we were once corrupt but to be renewed in what the spirit of your minds and to put on the new self created after what the likeness